| Overview |
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Purpose of meeting: Status of Immigration Detainees in custody of Department of Corrections through a contract with Immigration and Customs Enforcement By Department of Corrections; Witnesses: Nicolas Olano, Immigration Attorney, Nations Law Group; Cindy Woods, Alaska Civil Liberties Union; Civil Division, Department of Law; Sean Quirk, Kellogg Hansen Judiciary Committee members present: Andrew Gray, chair; Genevieve Mina; Ted Eischeid Other legislators who later sat with the panel and asked questions: Donna Mears: Ky Holland, Andy Josephson Commissioner of Correction (DOC), Jen Winkelman, testifying by video. You can listen to a recording of the meeting here.
The National Detention Standards for Non-Dedicated Facilities (Revised 2019) were mentioned often and quoted from a number of times. These are referenced occasionally as "the Trump guidelines." |
The overview lists some of the highlights. Below is my very rough transcript of the meeting. There's a lot missing, but it gives a sense of what was discussed. I was a couple of minutes late (I thought it was 1:30pm and when I double checked, I had to hustle.) The room was full and I had to sit on the floor. The video screen only faced the panel. Though I moved up to get a (bad) photo of one of the witnesses. The meeting was civil, even cordial, though serious concerns were raised.
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| Reps. Mears, Eischeid, Gray, and Mina (l-r) |
Q, Gray: Type of contract we have between DOC and Federal government - unusual?
A, Winkelman: Statute allows the commissioner to contract with other states or US to take prisoners. Regard to US, we have agreements since we took federal prisoners because there is no federal prison in Alaska.
Q: Describe the contract?
A: Current contract in place since 2013. Effective until terminated in writing. I'll make sure committee has copy.
Q: How will Alaska be reimbursed?
A: A daily bed rate for individuals in our custody, daily rate we bill federal government.
Q: This decision to bring these people made through your leadership?
A: Because contract, we have a good working relationship. June 4 local ICE agent contacted staff and asked how many could Anchorage safely house. We calculated that. Anchorage is the only facility that could house for more than 72 hours. Other prisons in Alaska cannot go over 72 hours. Two big asks:
1. Names and ?? of those coming and 2. medical information. They delivered. We do not normally know who is coming in from any agency. So this was hugely helpful to know who was coming. ICE and DOC remarkable teamwork. We knew who was coming. Expecting 59, but only 41 came. Two were picked up the next day and then 2 more. 35 now.
Q: Was theree any public notice?
A: Not from DOC.
Q: ??
A: Longstanding process. No public process, given our authority and statures. Checks and balance falls on Legislative audit?
Rep Eischeid Q: ICE approached DOC? A: Yes They asked how many could DOC house? Was there an answer?
A: We agreed on 59 when ICE asked. Our leadership checked available beds, staffing, etc. we agreed on 59.
Q: Requested on medical conditions.. How were detainees selected?
A: Great questions. Need to ask ICE.
Q: How many transferred to Alaska
A: ?????? 72 hour limit
Q: Did DOC have to move anyone out of Anchorage facility?
A: No. We did move them.. Due to regional ??? We could have housed the extras without movement. We decided to move some, to relieve burden on staffing. Nothing different from normal. We get heads up from local officials and move people out for med and safety reasons?
Q: Cost to Alaska from moving detainees from Washington state to here
A: Not that I know of. ... Daily costs covered by payments, food, clothing, staff, indirect costs
Q, Mina: ????
A: Per diem rate is $223.70 across the board.
Mina: What about medical costs? Per diem cover that?
A: Covers onsite medical costs, anything offsite handled through ICE
Mina: Training for staff AC for longer than 72 hours prisoners?
A: This is not unusual. over 72 hours, it happens. Staff trained to deal with that.
,,,, Moved here because of severe overcrowding in Tacoma
Q: Orientation for trainees and staff.
A: Phones, immediately given food on arrival. Following days, arrange for translation services for those with limited English. How to use digital law library. Answer questions. Effort to orient everyone as we do with others. Difference is how many came in at once.
[My note: This all sounds fine in the abstract, but how do you practically tell detainees with limited English (in various languages) about how to get translation services, and then how do they understand all the other instructions. This all depends on the sensitivity of the people doing this, and based on later testimony, there were lots of problems that this glosses over, or that Winkelman didn't know about.]
Q: Do all detainees have ICE detainee handbook?
A: I don't know
Q: ICE rules, page 20, say they need them.
Q, Eischeid: What Fed standards apply to detainees? Are you using Fed standards?
A: We are using Alaska State standards, we aim to achieve any national gold standard. That said, my reasoning saying it was a question for ICE, they had to approve our standards. They checked our policies and walked around our facilities and determined we have met their standards.
[I would say this answer is a "NO". There are specific standards in the Handbook which apply to ICE detainees, most of whom are not criminals, and have specific rights as detainees seeking legal decisions about their rights to stay in the US. These are quite different from what a prison would have for criminal inmates who have been sentenced by a court.]
Q: Can attorneys meet with detainees?
A: Yes. Bumpy at first. We have people protesting every day. Need to check if visits authorized. We are adding additional rules, work with ICE on who is approved to visit detainees. We have attorneys, family, and others trying to meet with inmates. I would say yes.
Q: Do you have standards about seeing an attorney within 24 hours.
... A: We do. we saw new people coming in and out
Grey interrupting: "New rules, p. 166, should permit visits 7 days a week including holiday. p. 168 able to meet with prospective attorneys... Attorneys here not that aware. It seems should be pretty open access.
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| National Detention Standards p. 166 |
A: I will state my understanding. That is why initial days, staff thought they had to go through vetting process, told that by ICE agent, but shown invalid.
Eischeid: Seems from outside looking in, seems that since detainees from ICE but it's a facility that doesn't usually deal with detainees. Not good?
A: We have custody of both criminal and non-criminal detainees. Difference was how many came in at once. That caused the bumps
Q: Previously, you said you got 2-3 detainees before?
A: Didn't give a number, but yes,
Mina: ICE decides who is approved for meetings with detainees?
A: Our first understanding, but some of those restrictions have been lifted.
Mina: For just legal or members of the public?
A: Yes.
Mina: Immigration hearings - can they attend in a timely manner. What happens if hearing is out of state, but they are here.
A: Yes. ICE are the gatekeepers. Their court dates are not something we are aware of. ICE schedules that. Need to ask ICE.
Mina: Process for detainee wanting to communicate with their counsel
A: They have access to phone system and help on how to use it.
Gray: P. 171 guidance - detainees MUST be advised. Allowed to meet in a private room - none of that mentions phone meetings. [Guidance here refers to National Detention Standards mentioned above.] [I think he meant p. 168. Page 171 is about consular (not counselor) visits.
Mina: What's the process...
A: ICE determines when ready for release. We do not handle that paper work
Mina: A lot of articles on conditions. Access to go outside, exercise, religious services
A: One hour outside daily. Day room for exercise, religious. DOC chaplain. Dietary preferences, need to request for things not available. Dietary - any special diets DOC provides. Many special diet
[My comment: These may be the rules, but how they are carried out is another story. The attorney testimony below offers examples of the rules not being adhered to.]
Eischeid: ???
A: Don't know. Part 2 - nothing brought to me that has been an issue.
Eischeid: Problems with family requests?
A: Not to my knowledge, hasn't been long enough to really know. I know about legal rep, and we worked through that. Haven't been doing this long enough - nothing has risen to my attention. Only ten days so far.
[My note: 'nothing has risen to my attention' is probably accurate, but allows for lots of problems that she doesn't know about.]
Eischeid: Under what conditions handcuffed?
A: Only time when being transported, other than ???, handcuffed in front.
Eischeid: Any use of force?
A: Incident in unit where verbal demonstration, aggressively, did not want to lock down, No one was gassed, moved to rooms for lock down.
Gray: I believe that was June 12 afternoon. What are reasons for lockdown. How long?
A: Happen routinely multiple times a day, or emergencies. The incident in question, don't know if routine or emergency.
Gray: P.3 of Trump guidance. Any lockdown reported to ICE. Was that done?
A: I'm going to say yes. I know we do that regularly, but I don't know that specific one.
Gray: I heard about that incident from many people. One detainee asking for access to his property so he could get contact info for his counsel, and then everyone was pepper sprayed.
A: No one was pepper sprayed.
Gray: Rules - medical officials check on health issues before
A: I don't know
Gray: We do know that at least one was on a respiratory and others get sick
Mina: Mental health services provided? Paid by?
A: Yes, both medical and mental health. Cost of care. In person in their module multiple times a day, explaining how to request information. Fill out form, triaged by nursing.
Mina: Law libraries. How to get access to Anchorage libraries?
A: Law library is not available. Get info, working with someone getting translated. Any other info is available.
Mina: Turnaround time reaching out to ACC and making it happen.
A: Wed June 4 and ???
Mina: Current contract ...?
A: Tough questions, how many can we safely house. This was not unusual, except for the # in one day. We had a heads up.
Gray: From several sources, two lockdowns, one pretty lengthy.
A: Not aware, but knew lockdown on No Kings Day.
Gray: Not allowed to shower of change clothes after pepper spray. Wasn't able to change underwear for three days. Guidance says one day.
A: First I've heard about this. I will look into that.
Gray: Thanks. Hope you can stay on as we get other expert testimony.
Woods, ACLU attorney: experience 8 years on Mexican border. These individuals are not incarcerated from criminal offense, just immigration issues. Protected from harm, medical and mental health care. Brothers, partners, fathers. Some have been granted .... but being held in punitive conditions. 3 people per cell with one open toilet. Two showers per week. No spare clothing at all. No windows. Out of cell are shackled. Been on a lot of lockdown. Deprived of personal belongings, including contact info. Only 4 telephones only 2-3 available. Only two free phone calls. No international calls. No way to buy phone accounts, others have others do that. Pepper spray, lasers, isolation. Very concerned about well being. Struggling with punitive setting and isolation. Access to religious materials gone unanswered.
Concerned ability to deal with legal needs. No access to immigration case law or ways to copy documents. I have heard personally. Does not comply with standards
Gray: how many have you met with? 5 personally
Other experiences: Family detention centers have different standards, Legal trailer, attorneys on the ground, detainees able to walk to trailer. Also experience elsewhere, didn't have to prove my legal id.
Gray: Different here?
A: Very different from Tacoma and elsewhere. In Tacoma they have tablets in cells to call family, no handcuffs, more outside, no strip search after speaking to legal counsel
Gray: Commissioner, is that your understanding?
A: I will find out. They will follow any protocol criminal detainees follow.
Gray: Woods says they do not have access to property?
A: I know there was delay. Property an issue at the beginning. I believe resolved.
Eischeid: Trump guidance says, Before trainees transferred all items returned to detainees.
Mina:
Woods: Complicated legal issues. Type of immigration, entry location, asylum, Some detainees are legal residents and have durable legal status to be in US
Gray: We'll go to next witness .. Nicholas Olano
Olano: Immigration attorney. 14 years in Alaska f5 years before that
Gray: What do you do with Alaskans picked up?
Olano: If arrested by ICE ...???
Gray: How often held in Alaska. A: Normally 72 hours. ICE would want to move them out of Alaska as fast as possible.
Olono: Designed as criminal setting.
Gray: Still getting people sent to Tacoma?
Olano: ?????
Gray: Your experience that Alaska detainee could put up bond?
Olano: Yes
Gray: Compare to Florida experi3ence
Olano: Very different. Florida designed for this. These individuals used to system and not prepared to be in criminal center.
Gray: What risks?
Olano: Couldn't say?
Gray: Anything wrong in being in criminal setting?
Olano: Being held in punitive setting, not what would happen elsewhere.
Gray: Commissioner Winkelman, do you know if they are being shackled when meeting with attorneys?
A: No, but know that there are different requirements for prisoners.
Gray: Protocol for shackling when meeting with legal - they aren't criminals.
Mina: Do you know if detainees had opportunity to be released on bond?
Olano: Some were elegible in Tacoma.
Gray: Final attorney Sean Quirk
Learning a lot from testimony today. Communications hard from the beginning, and got passed off to others. Took a while to get 30 minute call Wednesday. First contact since transferred. Client said they took away all his papers. He hadn't memorized my phone number so couldn't call me.
Gray: Commissioner can you speak to different phone time rules.
A: Rec time is one hour per day. Will follow up on discrepancies.
Gray: One hour a day outside five days a week. Seems they are getting that. Trouble contacting attorneys via phone. Why?
A: I know at the beginning of transfer there were problems. This is the first time I'm hearing about it. I will be following up.
Gray: p.160 of guidance - facilities shall not restrict # of calls to reps.
Mina: Attempts to contact your client?
Sean Quirk: Everyone we contacted told us to contact someone else. Emails. Found out he was in Anchorage on Monday and took til Wednesday. Time difference and language makes it harder. 8-4 Alaska time difficult.
Mina: Also looking at p 160 of Trump standards. This pertains to emergency calls, staff should help has fast as possible. Mon-Wed seems longer than the 8 hour ideal. Question for Mr. Quirk. Facilities should help making confidential call, staff should help them make the call confidentially. Your client get this?
Quirk: Once we did confirmed no one in the room with him. I don't know about process. He has not contacted me since Wednesday.
Mina: Staff made it possible to contact attorneys?
DOC: Yes, aware of and working on it. Challenge in this situation. From out of state, language barriers. I'm working on.
Gray: Situation Mr. Quirk described not learning about client transfer for a week. Common?
Alano: common
Wood: There is a requirement that ICE notify you.
Alano: In my client's case notice did not happen.
Quirk: ICE has to notify 24 hours in advance. Didn't happen
Eischeid: Describe the papers that were lost
Quirk: All his documents, passport and docs to prove his asylum case, and what we sent to him, engagement letter, and others. All gone with transfer. As far as I know from Wed. he has not received them.
Gray: Open Questions to public.
Rep Mears: I have concerns with what is happening with ICE. 2 big areas: 1 Elsewhere in ICE facilities and here we have criminal incarceration facilities. 2. Alaska is far away. No contact with family, friends, and other local sources. Contracts .... Opportunity to ask questions. Hope hearings lead to changes.
Gray: p. 163 "To maintain detainee morale and family relationships encourage family visits" How are family from Lower 48 encouraged to come.
DOC: I don't know. Treating like any other criminal or civil detainee. Extremely hard when folks are far away.
Gray: Have any family or friends had visits
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| Reps. Gray, Mina, Holland, and Josephson (l-r) |
Josephson: Why are we investing energy and time treating guidance as advisory, not compulsory. We are only being refunded for out costs. Why are we doing this at all.
DOC: Fair questions. Because of military presence and us not having a federal detention center, we will continue to be a federal partner, and one of those partners is ICE. Don't usually stay in Alaska more than 72 days. Same ICE agent in that area is same as for Alaska. Asked if we could we safely house detainees for 30 days. We said yes. That's where we are at.
Josephson: Asked if contract requires us to cooperate? Admin could have decided not to do this?
DOC: That's fair to say. Longstanding contract in place and we were asked how many we could safely house? If we had been full, it could have been a different answer
Josephson: You said deployed and then said not used. If pepper spray was used, not directly against detainees?
DOC: Used on the ground, not directly on detainees.
[my short break]
Gray: Change in per diem price change, related to new ICE detainees?
DOC: Coincidental - old contract ended May 31.
Gray: Were they able to bring medications with them Enough supply?
DOC: Yes, Yes. One of our big asks, before they arrived - that we had medical abstract for each detainee and their medication.
Rep. Holland: Is there a duty or procedure at DOC to protect the rights of people held in custody to be sure not moved in way to disrupt their proceedings
DOC: That is something we do for all incarcerated. But ICE is responsible for who is moved and when.
Mina: Alaskan ?? ICE
DOC: Currently undergoing recertification
Mina: Timeline for recertification?
DOC: You need to ask ICE
Mina: We heard 30 minute limite on phone call. Is that enough time for translation services or legal advice?
DOC: Fair question and I'll follow up on that.
Mina: 3 people to a cell normal?
DOC: Thanks for the question, when it came up I wanted to comment. There is enough room in the module, there is enough - we asked if they want to move to another cell, they have banded together and so despite having room to move out of three in a cell and many have chosen not to.
Mina: to attorneys, do you agree with that?
Wood: I haven't heard that people choose to stay in a cell with three.
Gray: repeated q
DOC: I asked before this hearing and was reassured that was their decisions.
[Of course we don't know what the conditions of moving were that caused the detainees to stay put? Into cell with people who don't speak their language? Other issues?]
Mina: 30 days - ??
DOC: When ICE contacted us, they contacted ACC knowing we could hold longer than 72 hours, need to stay for up to 30 days. So, beyond that, I don't know their plan going forward.
Mina: No restriction, right now DOC just waits to see what will happen?
DOC: Short answer is yes, but we are in regular contact with ICE agent to be in the mod once per week. He has made frequent visits to the facility. The idea that we are in constant communication on when individuals are moving out. Six have already moved out.
[No one has asked who this ICE agent is for Alaska and Tacoma]
Mina: Other states have overflow?
DOC: I'm not aware and have a good working relationship with the ICE agent and he overseas Alaska and Tacoma and contacted us. Unusual request and one we could meet
Mina: To attorneys: are you aware of other states?
Woods: Others have federal detention facilities. To our knowledge, Alaska is only state where detainees in State facilities.
Gray: Some negotiations that facility in Adak being considered.
DOC: I have not in any knowledge in my professional capacity, though I read in news article or on social media heard about it.
Olano: Anchorage is already very far away. We are not El Salvador. How to get people there, This will cost Alaskans money. Bad idea.
Woods: Practice to get them to facilities where it's hard to access and potential expansion to Guantanamo. I haven't heard of it but will take it seriously.
Escheid: Anything that prohibits state legislators touring the ACC and seeing the conditions?
DOC: Nothing and I would encourage it and welcome it.
Gray: Not an easy hearing from Commissioner Winkelman and appreciate you being here and responding.
DOC: I appreciate the comments. Hard questions and not easy. Ultimately at the end of the day. I have a passion for this work. Often difficult. Two types of authority. Encourage everyone to reach out and if there are things, let us know. I want a better DOC. Kudos for my staff for how they have handled this. Increased pressure surrounding social unrest surrounding this issue. I have phenomenal staff and couldn't do my job without them.
Gray: To media, pages 172-4 says media can schedule meetings with detainees. Also like to thank Department of Law. They chose to answer in writing and they are available on BASIS. You can see the letter here.
Concludes hearing at 3:10 pm
