THESE ARE ROUGH NOTES I TOOK DURING THE MEETING. THEY AREN'T VERBATIM, THEY PROBABLY HAVE LOTS OF TYPOS, GAPS, AND MY OWN ABBREVIATIONS, BUT THEY SHOULD GIVE YOU A REASONABLY GOOD IDEA OF WHAT WENT ON - SUBSTANCE AND MOOD.
I would note that it is always good to check your stereotypes against the facts. With four people appointed by Republicans and one by an independent (I don't know how the Supreme Court Chief Justice registers) it does make the board seem pretty one-sided. But the talk today was pretty strongly aware of the dangers of political bias in this process and the chair said several times there would be no bias and that he had not spoken to the Governor or the head of the Republican Party about the process other than at his interview for the job with the Governor. Of course, that doesn't mean there might not be unconscious bias or even that it's all a show, but I felt more encouraged.
The Notes:
Alaska Redistricting Board Meeting
Wednesday March 16, 2010
411 W. 4th Suite 302
1. Call to Order
2. Roll Call - John Torgerson, Jim Holm, Marie N. Greene, PeggyAnn McConnochie
Robert Brodie missing - trouble flying out of Kodiak
3. Agenda Approval
4. Approve prior Minutes
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| l-r: Torgerson, Bickford (staff), Holm McConnochie, White(attorney) |
5. Election of Vice-Chair - postponed until Robert Brodie arrives
6. Roll Call Staff, Public - Staff: Taylor Bickford, Michael White, attorney, Ron Miller, Executive Director
7. Public Comments
A. Invited Presentation Native POLICY CENTER
Denise Morris - Pres. First Alaskans , and have Liz Medicine Crow and Rick Mueller,
Policy Analyst at First Alaskans.
Break to get Teleconference online. Technical problems with teleconferencing.
10:52: Teleconference ok
Denise Morris again: Juneau connected.
Denise Morris: Pres of 1st Alaskans, Liz Medicine Crow, Rick Mueller Sr. Pol Analyst
Policy Center insures Alaska Natives are empowered and participate in policy
Also leadership group, Elders-Youth conference each year
Involvement in redistricting - FA dedicated as
[Can’t hear you - break try to move mic closer]
ANative Policy center in 2006 designated as Census info center for Alaska. We’ve been publishing info on redistricting. ANQuarterly - importance in involvement in participating in redistricting, Info on outreach, prepared public hearing and notice schedule, draft of letters people can use. Want to be resource for Redistricting Board - sharing information. We’ve had about 7000 hits on website in last month alone. Networked and linked to all organizations around alaska.
As draft plans are available we’d like to distribute them.
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| Mueller, Morris, Medicine Crow from First Alaskans Institute |
Liz Medicine Crow - Tlingit Haida from Kake =
We’re at the beginning of this.
Plan how to engage and empower AN community to participate, feel welcome, know how to engage. Tips on how to present public testimony. Drafts now until we talk to you. Also looking at the different proposed plans shared, concerns raised, and see how it will impact the AKN community.
Will come here to monitor. Yesterday. You released information on population. Put it up on our Facebook page. 7000 hits in a month. Your FB page is good, allows people to hook up immediately. Looking to be as helpful as we can for ANs and others. Also looking at 2020 process.
Rick Mueller - policy analyst, originally from Ketchikan. Job to look at draft plan, analyze it district by district and see how it impacts AK Native community pos and neg.
Q: PeggyAnn McConnochie: Thanks for your involvement - we
are going to need a lot of help, is greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Marie Green: One suggestion - use local radio stations in rural Alaska. This material is great and I appreciate what you’ve already done.
Ron Miller: Liz was recently named one of the top under 40 Alaskans.
John Torgerson: Thank you very much.
B. Other public comments
Torgerson: About 20 people who want to testify. Limit to 30 minutes
By Phone: [I did get the list of people calling in so I could spell the names right]
Robert Venables- rep SE Conference: Thank you all for providing teleconference. Encourage as much meetings held in SE, especially district 5 which seems to be disappearing.
John Torgerson: Thanks, appreciate use of your connections around the communities. Will set this afternoon, which communities we’ll visit. You can go online and get updates.
Dave Metheny: STatewide coordinator for AK Dem party. Process not been particularly smooth on opening end. Case: changing phone numbers over the last three days. Wondering why testimony on front end, so we could respond to issue raised in meeting. Will all the work be done in open meetings with criteria being transparent? Cognizant open meeting laws apply except for executive session. Also people must have ‘adequate’ notice of meetings. Also, trouble getting info from redistricting board at this point. Hope you open it up a bit more. We need help to get Dem activists involved in process. Hope that motive of board is true, questioning slightly at this point.
John Torgerson: What info trouble getting?
Metheny- census data, timelines of meeting, phone lines. Want to get our people plugged in.
John Torgerson: We got the census data yesterday, it was on the web in two hours. How much faster should we do it?
Metheny: That’s fine.
John Torgerson: We will follow public meeting law - five days notice I believe.
Randy Ruedrich: Thank board for taking important task that will have impact on AK for ten years. Address issue that came to attention. March 1 memo - prisoner population attributions. Corrections published in Feb 2002- B of Census will provide group data for each prison in the state to allow you to consider attributing info back to their residences. We have about 5800 indivduals, 30-35% AK Native. That means representation of prison system is more than 100% greater as we work voting rights issues. To protect voting rights of AK natives, if over 2000 in system and can attribute them back to their home towns will increase those districts and impacts will be less and impact on majority and minority populations will be less. Encourage you to pursue this. If the average felon is only in for 387 days. Half the people counted in the correction system are already home. Got back faster than census data. Encourage you to seek legal counsel on this. Before we go to District Court in DC.
PeggyAnn McConnochie McConnochie: Incarcerated in AK or anywhere?
Ruedrich: In state. We have some in Colorado. Basically those in April of last year. This data is available, so we could get the 4800 ….
John Torgerson: we gave it to our attorney. He’ll share his thoughts this pm
Heide Schoppenhorst, District 6 ???: Not sure about meeting purpose. Residents in rural Alaska, rumors that not enough people in villages and Dis. 6 might get lumped in with another district. Please don’t lump us with a place like Fairbanks. A big city isn't going to represent rural Alaska. If lumped with someone, we’d like Noth Slope.
Tanya Beatus: Fairbanks: Speaking on behalf for Alaskans for Fair Redistricting: Non-partisan, unions, AK native, civic. Volunteers interested in process. Not new. Have teams seeking inputs from people to understand the ramifications both urban and rural. Understand hard taks to get right number and meeting all the legal tasks. And all this in 90 days. We stand ready to help and hope to present plan for your consideration.
John Torgerson. We will have a meeting in Fbanks.
Tom Okleasik: Kotzebue: goal to enhance education and have more democracy. In redistricting important. Only one senator and rep to legislature. Particularly with the resources that go to state budget from our district.
Don Gray: Interior District vice chair for Dem Party 6,7,8,9,11, and part of 12. 40 year resident. Appreciate the work you do. Lots of changes over the decades. 1980s, only had 8900 people in my Fairbanks district. Became district 7 in 90s. One district from North Pole to UAF - 15 miles. Long skinny arm that wnt thru Dist. 33. I lived in 32 then. 32 came about in he 90s. Not the kind of district we’d like to see. 2000 districts became more compact. Board goal to make communities focal point there. I hope looking ahead, we’re a district - very helpful to see how we’ve grown - over 20,000 in what is currently district 7, up 15,000 from years ago. All the others larger than the ideal 17,755.
….You have big task. Speed precision and fairness
,
Ed Schoenfeld: No questions, just listening.
Lupe Marroquin: Representing self and former election professional. Thanks for your service. What is involvement of Gov’s office in this process and conversations with the Gov and if so what were the topics and how resolved and will the public continue to be advised.
John Torgerson: Constitutionally created board, neither under leg or gov. we cannot be public officials, independent, to keep board as private citizens. Gov. appointed two members - other than initial interview, I’ve had no conversations with the governor. Don’t intend to.
John Bolling: Craig. Thanks in advance. Hope board will be able to visit here.
John Torgerson. We did get letter from City of Craig and we will listen. My advice to board is we take up your invitation to invite neighboring folks.
Geric Jordan: Thank you. Mr. Chairman. Mayor of Sitka. Lifelong AK resident. Want to be sure you keep Sitka intact, don’t cross line thru community. Will members of the public be able to speak privately to the board members. Under open meetings act, 2 or less, can meet.
Mr. White: Any time more than 2 get together it has to be an open meeting. There is no legal impediement to indiviuals talking to individual members. As member of the public free to contact any board memeber. If that board member will talk to you hasn’t been decided.
Jordan: So, yes, private citizen will be allowed to meet with two members privately.
White: Not what I said. We haven’t decided yet. Whether board will hold meetings with indiividuals. not decided.
Jordan: Have you met with members of the public about redistricting?
John Torgerson: I have and I would recommend this board not put a cap on members talking to indiviuals. It’s part of the process. I think unconstitutional to gag board members from talking to the public. We are in the same offices, but don’t gt together. Indivi
[These people were in the room. I didn’t get their names so I apologize if I spell them wrong.]
Kristie Smithers: City Clerk right? Thank. AK Association of Municipa Clerks, Wasilla, Clerk from Palmer (Janette Bower), Sheri Pierce? Valdez Muni Clerk. Speaking for clerks, about 100 members. Some have done redistricting and newer clerks a bit intimidated. Not sure of the impact. In vally, very fast growing. Lots of interesting annexations. Over past few years, some examples, a map. Covered by District 14. Had annexation. One parcel in district 15. Doesn’t impact me because no reg voters in that area. I might have to have a precinct for one possible voters. That would allow others to know how that person cast ballot. Not only muni that has these issues, Kenai, Matsu, etc. Muni clerks run our elections every year. Public comes to us to ask why this happens. We have a lot of issues - “Why do I have to drive by three precincts to get to my precincts? Drive 14 miles? Have to have mail ballots.
Use water bodies, Alaska RR. RCA boundaries - they will encompass cities in future. City boundaries not necessarily the best. We are here to help you. Appreciate your time today.
John Torgerson: Precinct boundaries set by Lt. Gov office not the board.
Christie Smithers: We can’t cross state district boundaries to allow one person.
Jake Metcalf. 4th genration alaskan, born and raised in Juneau, lived in BEthel, now in Anchorage. SErved in City Council in Bethel. Anchorage School Board. Also as former chair of AK Dem party 2004-7. Chair of AK Dem Party redistricitng committee. I know that you and bord have one of democracies most important tasks to complete in a fair manner. Relying on process to be open and fair and legally ???
Have a list of questions in letter form. I’ll read a few I know time is limited.
1. What criteria used in drawing the lines. Keeping community of interest together - will you use?
2. Given pop shifts over the decades, possible to avoid retrogression in minority voting strength.
3. How much variance among districts do you think is allowable?
Looked briefly at material you’ve provided here. mr. White’s memo to you on a number of questions. One answer - advice - avoid backdoor politics and that board has to follow open meetings law. My advice and question: open government, transparency especially important in this process. Follow up on Mr. Jordan’s question in Sitka about meetings with individuals - and I agree that members should get to talk. I’m wondering if the board individually or in groups of one or two have met with Mr. Ruedrich. If there have been, what I’d ask for is that in the future to avoid backdoor politics, that in future such meetings all parties at the meeting. Important.
John Torgerson: I’ve met with Mr. Ruedrich as much as I’ve met with you. Zero. Call me and I’ll meet with you. Not saying we’ll agree, but you’ll be able to pull on my ear. Some..
Deborah Williams: Exec Dir AK Dem Party . Thanks you the board and staff. Thanks for the tremendous public service you are doing. Nothing more important than one person one meaningful vote. This R Board has the technical ability to make our votes meaningful or not very meaningful. Ability to gerrymander, depriving people of meaningful voting. And call also draw lines to ??? political prties and keeping current office holders out. I’m not hinting this board is going to do that.
Our current districts in Anc and Fbks are compact and represent the communities well. There will have to be adjustments, but those adjustments, espe. in Anchorage and FBks. Avoid pitting incumbents against each other and gerrymandering. There can be - as you say in your own documents - no political gerrymandering. Our constitution says this should not be political. Thank you so much for your work. You’ve heard from a lot of Dems today, We do care a lot. We really wish you the best.
Leonard Lawson: Here representing alliance for reproductive justice. Our director couldn’t make it. We want to involve people. We want to be involved for our members. Extreme work to learn software etc. We would really like to know the guideles the board will use to draw districts. What will happen when guidelines conflict? Which will you choose. Guidelines, hard and fast rules, order of precedence. We are in the same 30 day and 60 day deadlines.
2. Lookng through some of th legal issues in the documents you provided. You asked about incumbent maps. Is the board going to be using them? You said the use of non-partisan incumbent protection is justified. What does that mean? That all stay in districts they’re in? etc.
1. When guidelines come out?
2. How important is incumbent protection? How non-partisan?
3. Protecting existing districts important? If districts keep changing discourages involvement.
John Torgerson: guidelines on agenda for later this afternoon.
Amazing to say, with all the population changes - don’t know how you can preserve the district? 9000 people growth in one district? 4000 loss in another.
Incumbent map question -could you put tht in writing?
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| Handouts - These should all be online |
Rest of the agenda:
8. Old Business review of open meeting act.
Mr. White: video ** a few places I stopped taking notes and took video - later for that
John Torgerson: PeggyAnn McConnochie has served on public boards
9. New Business
A. Budget update
$1,954,255 total 975,000 left project to carry forward into FY 12
Budget is under gov’s office - personnel - submitted request to continue in 2012. about $3.2 million for overall appropriation - 2000-2001 process little less that $5million
No money for payments for lawsuits.
Mr. Holms - balance is negative #. Why?
John Torgerson:
Miller: Personnel services $400,000+ projecting. Have available ??? very liberal projections to make sure we have enough. Part will be taken by voting rights act consultant.
[12:05pm] B. Adopt time-line for public hearings
Need our fifth member here to complete this.
Miller: left message thought plane would get here around 11:45 and would come straight from the airport.
Torgerson: I hate to delay because of teleconference. Don’t know what else to do. Take recess. Need all our board members when we take up this agenda and go forward as a board. With that we’ll take at least a ten mintue recess.
12:30 - Brodie had weather problems coming out of Kodiak is here now.
Torgerson: Teleconference bridgeline had some problems from overloading. We’ll disconnect video, it will be on internet - go to site and click on legislative.tv on front page.
[High volume] Good test for our equipment here.
John Torgerson - recognize board members won’t be able to go to all the meetings, but as much as we can on the pre-plan hearings. Post plan hearings, need to divide board into teams of three teams of two with attorneys being other team. Divide the state up and have the pre-plan meetings with at least two. But sometimes run into weather issues. I’d love go to all the meetings, but know probably impossible. Members have day jobs you have to pay attention to.
First issue:
C. Pre-plan hearing sites. Timeline yesterday morning 9:45 got Census data, so we must be complete April 14 at 9:45. A little quicker getting the data than I hoped. But I understand they were afraid of govt. shutdown if resolution didn’t pass Congress, but it did. Last ten days 4th April- 14th like board to consider being here all that time. We’ll do a lot drawings as a board. Consider public comments, where we want to draw the lines. then ten days. Whether we work weekends up to the board.
Block out those ten days.
Open to general discussion: Time Conflicts?
I’ll start. I have to be on Kenai 21st and 24th hour each day, previously set up and can’t do anything about. If in hearings. I’d fly home and be back. Meetings from 12-1. Back by 2:30 or so.
Mr. Holms - April 2 I have open house at my store. Only day. Weekends are better not to be here.
PeggyAnn McConnochie McConnochie - I can move things around.
Mr. White - My time is your time
Mr. Brodie - couple of evening meetings in Kodiak, nothing big
Ms. Greene - probably 14th of April - Nana Board meeting. Meeting here in Anchorage.
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| Brodie and Greene |
Suggestion to meet every afternoon about 2:30pm - in mornings do things on our own, meet with people, etc.
Brodie: Would we, say next week go to these communities and then meet after that?
John Torgerson: Throwing out global thoughts - have to post meetings five days out, so have to post in advance to meet the open meeting requirements. It says reasonable length of time. Not sure if really five days Maybe when leg goes into 24 hour rule. . . No joking.
they’d like to video conference a lot, it takes coordination. If we do five days,
22nd, first date, maybe the 21st, count Sundays.
I suggest we start on 22.
Brodie - you have meeting on 21, what if we meet in Kenai?
Torgerson - not going to Kenai.
Going as one board to first one [preplan], then in teams. We should go out as a board to major metropolitan areas. After were done with plan, the next 60 days we’ll go as teams. That was my thought. Objection to starting March 22?
PeggyAnn McConnochie OK
C. Pre-plan hearing sites
Anchorage, Bethel, Fairbanks, Juneau, Palmer, Kotzebue, Statewide teleconference
All day trips? Can we come in the morning and leave at night?
Greene: yes.
Brodie: Could do Anchorage and Palmer in one day.
Torgerson: Don’t intend to limit presentations to three minutes if groups come in to present plans.
Brodie: We’ll entertain plans?
Discussion about times
If people have plans, give us notice so we could schedule afternoon time to hear it.
Try to start at noon and end at 7pm
White: Do you really want to set an ending time. If it ends at 3pm, do we want to sit until 6pm?
John Torgerson: I don’t mind sitting there.
Holm: People don’t know. It may be hard to get there on time, we give them a definitive time. Opportunity to email us and tell us we can’t be there till 6.
John Torgerson: in perfect world like to have public hearing for plans at a certain time and just public comments at a different time. You need an actual start and stop time. 7 or 8 hours is a long time.
PeggyAnn McConnochie: set up agenda saying plans first, then five minute public comment. Say that longer commenters should register - as with 1st Alaskans - to let us know they want more time. Not saying it well. We want to hear them all, don’t want to chop them off.
12am start 7pm
Holm = 12pm
Brodie: Adjust for community and airplane schedule
March 22:
Torgerson: Anyone have additional locations for preplan hearings
PeggyAnn McConnochie: I’d suggest Ketchikan.
White: Aluetians?
John Torgerson: No Dutch Harbor? We should add it.
Objections to adding Ketchikan? OK, added.
Anhorage and Fairbanks and Palmer easy to set.
Suggestions for
March 22: Anchorage
enough time for interested parties to come up with plans?
[Audience shaking heads no]
OK, Anchorage March 22.
March 23: Palmer
March 24 not available.
March 25 Friday - Fairbanks on ??
Can we get to Kotz from Fairbanks?
Greene: one flight a day - hour. Three flights out of Anchorage?
Can’t do Fairbanks - Kotz - Anchorage
PeggyAnn McConnochie: Since we added Ketchikan and Juneau then
John Torgerson: why is 28th circled? Sewards Day. State Holiday but not Federal.
Juneau on 25
Ketchikan on 26
Sunday day off
March 28 Fairbanks
March 29 Kotzebue
Greene - we should reverse that because of airline schedule, ok that will work
March 30 Bethel
March 31 Statewide teleconference
White: good to have a break for time to put materials together and to analyze
John Torgerson: If we have 3 people in office is that violation? [of public meetings law]
White: If working in the office but not meeting, not a problem.
John Torgerson: three day weekend, back on 4th.
Motion to adopt our proposed pre-plan hearings
Anchora 22 12pm- 7pm for all unless areas where we can’t
Brodie - in Saturday we ould adjust it in Ketchikan
Palmer 23
Juen 24
Ketch 25
Faribanks 29
Kotz 30
Statewide March 31
Passed.
Rest of pre plan 30 days - board members own schedules, can be in he office and work on the plan, won’t be official board meetings. April 4th, to 14th we’re here in the office to set plans.
Afternoon meetings- might be open ended.
White: Don’t have to adjourn the meeting, could have one meeting and recess and come back in. Last year board did that. What happens? I’d probably notice them.
John Torgerson: start time is important.
PeggyAnn McConnochie McConnochie: I’d like the public to know start times. Rolling recess not good.
John Torgerson: times they met and recessed and came back the next day. I’d suggest 4th to the 8th we set time at 2pm til 5pm.
Brodie: What are we doing from 8-2?
John Torgerson: DRawing plans on the computer, work in teams of two to work on plans. Could be for an hour.
Brodie: How will it work if not all five here.
John Torgerson: assume that spend time as individuals so you hae thoughts.
Video discussion how to work;
PeggyAnn McConnochie - I’d like morning and then in the afternoon, opportunities to work as meeting. Extending it to 6pm is reasonable to allow working people to come.
John Torgerson: Open to Public Comment every day. Probably won’t be a work product.
PeggyAnn McConnochie: Not necessarily open to public, but allow the to hear our thinking. We’ll have heard a lot of people around the state.
John Torgerson: If we get a lot of people at 6, we could state.
Brodie: I wouldn’t necessrily preculde call in period from public?
John Torgerson: Beginning?
Brodie: or the end.
John Torgerson: How do I select the people for those 15 minutes?
Marie Green: Don’t we want to have meet time available for the public? We start on the 22nd. Realistically, how much time, how prepared will the public be? I’m sure people will share their thoughts. Making time for public at these board meetings, welcome them to share. How can we make it so the public, we’ll be hearing from them, even during our board meetings.
John Torgerson: I hear the concerns. At some point we have to cut the umbilical cord and the board needs to do it’s work. Then we’ll have 60 post plan days to hear from people. Then you end up with public comment that may or may not be germaine to this board, but I’m thinking it has to be restricted or we won’t have time to do our work? First three or five to sign up? I don’t know. Talking out loud. Could take day toward the end for another teleconference. Defeating post plan time.
PeggyAnn McConnochie: I ee what you mean. Trying to get my mind around this. Concentrate on preplan hearings. Then we have to put up our plan. As much public observance of that as possible. It would be difficult if people were commenting on minutia at last minute for us to deal with rather than waiting for the pre-plan meeting.
John Torgerson: If we move a community into a new district, we’d have 400 people show up and wouldn’t get things done for weeks. Plenty to call us. Email us. We can answer those emails in the morning.
Is Sat. April 9 a day - it appears we should be working on that day too. Question: Do we want to work over the weekend 9th and 10th?
PeggyAnn McConnochie: we should.
Holm: I may have some problem
Keep to 2pm on weekends too. Mr. White, can we cancel if we need to?
Mr. White: There will be a lot of issues coming to a head then. How are we going to deal with this? There will be issues you need to discuss that will help you all as you put together the plan. Mr. Brodie, I know you said you didn’t contemplate a staff plan, but I don’t see how tht hurts to have another plan you can compare against.
Brodie, Green: sure
John Torgerson: I’m not quite there yet. Will staff have time to ‘be staff’ and to make their own plan. Where’s the priority? If I want these guys to do something for me, do they drop their plan?
White: You are the priority for the plan. But we have resources. Given scrutiny we’re going to get from the DOJ, the more plans we have looked at the better.
John Torgerson: Talking about completely plans, or work I’ve done on the computer? I’m guessing each of us willhave run through this 500 times, or are you saying we need to have five plans?
White: No, we’re talking about the same things. As long as you’ve looked at these alternatives.
John Torgerson: I don’t object to staff plan, but I need to think about it. We’re thinking of hiring another staff member - they’ve been doing some interviews. Three it people who can assist the bord. Maybe with that extra person we’ll have time.
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| Media were there for the first hour or so |
Bickford: I think it’s technically possible.
John Torgerson: I was told that. Not sure it can figure out retrogression.
Bickford: Software more built for urban areas. Popping out a plan for rural Alaska hard.
John Torgerson: Time for meetings? 8 or 9 - 11, 12, 13 8am start times.
Preplan schedule:
I will say what is there:
Not meeting April 1, 2, 3 - board members private time to work on own plans
April 4-10 daily meetings starting at 2pm until adjourn. Board members in offices doing own work in moring.
April 11-13 - 8am meetings. Passed.
Good discussion, what we needed to do.
[I'm experimenting here with the Break function that allows those who want to see the rest to go for it without this taking up any more room. Let's see if it works.]
